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From: Berhane Habtemariam (Berhane.Habtemariam@gmx.de)
Date: Mon Oct 18 2010 - 13:08:24 EDT
Asharq Al-Awsat Q & A with Sudan's Finance Minister Ali Mahmoud
18/10/2010
Asharq Al-awsat Interview by Mohammad Ali Salih
Q) Will the South vote for secession in next January's referendum, or will
Sudan remain a unified country?
A) We, as the President announced, are committed to two main aspects
regarding the upcoming referendum, which form the basis of the 2005
Comprehensive Peace Agreement. Firstly: to hold the referendum on a set date
and to acknowledge the results. Secondly: The referendum should be free and
fair. We pray to Almighty God that Sudan will not be divided, and that it
remains a unified country. However, there is a possibility that secession
might be the outcome, which poses many significant, potential problems. Of
course, as you might have heard, some Southern leaders have begun to talk
recently about the secession. Furthermore, Uganda has been outspoken in its
endorsement of Southern secession, and the possibility of intervening to
protect the newborn Southern state. We don't want to go to war, and we don't
want foreign intervention, neither in the south nor in the north.
Q) In your opinion, why did some Southern leaders change their mind and
begin calling for secession?
A) They are extremists; we believe the majority of the Southerners, if the
referendum is held freely and fairly, would vote for unification because we
are brothers who have lived together on the land of a unified Sudan, for
hundreds of years. Problems and civil wars occur in any country, but those
who call for secession are extremists. The Sudanese Oil Minister, Lual Deng,
who is a Southern unionist, has referred to the extremist Southerners as
"The Taliban of South Sudan", as a joke.
Q) Yet the possibility of secession exists?
A) We pray to Almighty God that it doesn't happen. If it does, we hope it
will be peaceful. As I just said, we and the Southerners have lived together
like brothers throughout Sudan's history, and we are bonded together by
multiple factors: family, patriotism, collective struggle, social and
economic issues. Although the American media focuses on the oil issue, oil
is not the foundation of our relationship with the South, and it never will
be.
If the South votes for secession, it is imperative that our shared social
and family relations are maintained. This goes for the commercial relations
too, because the South's only route for exporting oil would be to the North,
through the seaport of Port Sudan. If the oil wells are destroyed, both the
Northerners and the Southerners would lose. We will try and assist them in a
wide range of domains, introduce them to the international community, and
encourage tourism and investment in their newly established state.
Q) Was there any possibility of avoiding reaching such a point of division
in Sudan?
A) Many Southern leaders maintain that the National Congress Party is
responsible, because it has failed to make the idea of a unified Sudan
attractive to the South.
Well, what did those [Southern] leaders offer to make the idea of a unified
Sudan appealing? Why, since the very first day of concluding the 2005 peace
agreement, have they worked to transform the South into a separate state?
Why have they stopped all economic transactions with the government of
Sudan, and headed toward Uganda and Kenya?
Q) [Southern leaders] argued that the National Congress Party (NCP) focused
on implementing the Islamic Shariaa Law [instead of national unity], and the
NCP would not rule out the idea of dividing Sudan, in return for
implementing the Shariaa?
A) We did not impose the Shariaa on anyone. We said that every state and
province was free to apply the laws it deemed appropriate. If they want,
they can build mosques beside public bars in the South. However, there are
others who want to build mosques, without bars nearby.
Q)[Southern leaders] said the Northerners were practicing racial
discrimination against them?
A) Racial discrimination? How come? The First Vice President of Sudan is a
southerner. The Minister of Presidential Affairs is a southerner too, and so
is the Oil Minister. Furthermore, the southerners rule the South
independently without a single northerner in their government, yet they
participate in the governance of the North as well.
Q) Vice President of the Democratic Unionist Party (in opposition to the
NCP), Ali Mahmud Hassanein, recently told Asharq al-Awsat that the ruling
National Congress Party should be held accountable for the potential
division of Sudan, because ever since it came to power in 1989, following a
military coup, it acknowledged the right to self-determination for the
South?
A) I will answer this question in two parts: Firstly, we advocate the
freedom of the Southerners more than any other northern party, and maybe
even more than any southern party. How could we govern a group of people who
don't want us to govern them? Opposition parties repeatedly talk about
freedom and democracy. What about freedom for the southerners? We are proud
to be the first party to have agreed to grant the southerners their right to
self-determination.
Secondly, didn't the opposition parties agree to the southerners' right to
self-determination in the 1995 Asmara Agreement? Did they forget the years
of the National Democratic Alliance (NDA), and the collaboration with the
SPLM? Did they forget the concessions they had made to the SPLM? Now that
the SPLM has broken away from them, after exploiting the NDA and achieving
its goals, opposition parties want to lay the blame on the National Congress
Party, which from the very start, with good intentions and without political
manoeuvring, agreed to the right to self determination for the Southerners.
I say this and add that it was no coincidence that the SPLM signed a peace
agreement with the National Congress Party in 2005, and not with the
opposition parties. The SPLM must have trusted us more than them.
Q) How do you see the future?
A) As I told you, we sincerely pray to Almighty God that Sudan, the land of
our fathers and grandfathers, northerners and southerners, will not be
divided. And because we committed ourselves to conducting the referendum, we
will accept its results provided that it is free, fair and expressive of the
opinion of the ordinary Southern citizens who, as I said, want to continue
to live in unity with us. We have been their brothers and fellow citizens
for hundreds of years, long before the discovery of oil in the South. The
Ugandans and Kenyans want to cheat the Southerners out of their oil wealth.
They have neither respect nor appreciation for them.
Q) What is the purpose of your visit to Washington? And what did you
achieve?
A) Our purpose was to attend the World Bank annual meetings. For the first
time in many years, we have made a considerable improvement in Sudan's
relations with the World Bank. We have agreed to hold a series of round
table conferences to offer aid to Sudan, and examine ways of paying off its
external debt. The first round table conference was held during the World
Bank sessions. In that conference, World Bank Vice President for Africa,
Obiageli Ezekwesili, a Nigerian national, admitted that not only the South
needed the support of the World Bank, but also the North.
Soon, a round table conference and a number of workshops will be held to
study development projects all across Sudan, not only in the South. The
conference will be attended by top representatives. In addition to the World
Bank, member states and large investment corporations will take part.
Q) What will happen to Sudan's foreign debts, which have bordered on 40
billion dollars according to International Monetary Fund statistics?
A) As I just said, the subject will be discussed at the upcoming round table
conference. The World Bank Vice President for Africa said that Sudan's
foreign debt was a 'difficult issue' that concerned the entire Sudanese
people, northerners and southerners alike, regardless of the political
developments in Sudan, and the issue of southern secession.
Q) What will happen to Sudan's foreign debt if the South secedes?
A) Again, this will be discussed at the round table conference.
Q) Some Southern leaders declared that the South would not pay any of the
country's foreign debt, because they allege that successive governments of
the North borrowed and accumulated the debt, building bridges and factories
in the North, and purchasing arms to launch attacks against the Southerners.
A) I repeat, we are going to discuss the division of debts at the round
table conference. We talked with the World Bank and stipulated that the
issue be resolved before holding the referendum in the South.
Q) If the South secedes, will you request dividing the debts according to
population, for example?
A) Whether or not the South secedes, we will request that Sudan be exempted
of all its foreign debts. Sudanese Vice President Ali Osman Taha indicated
this while delivering Sudan's address, at the United Nations general
assembly last month. Taha noted that Sudan ought to be treated in the manner
of the least developed countries, and have the principle of debt exemption
applied to it.
Q) What role did the US play in improving Sudan's relation with the World
Bank?
A) The US representative in the World Bank presented initiatives to boost
cooperation with Sudan. We believe that the US administration has recently
been convinced that President Omar al-Bashir's government is committed to
implementing the 2005 peace agreement between the North and the South.
Actually, al-Bashir's government has met all terms of the agreement, unlike
the southern government, which has only met part of them. All that remains
is the referendum, and President al-Bashir has reiterated many times that we
are committed to its implementation, and the recognition of its findings.
Q) To what extent would the oil revenues of the Ministry of Finance suffer
if the South secedes?
A) We would lose 70 percent of our share of the oil reserves, and 50 percent
of our share of the oil revenues. We hope, and pray to God, that Sudan will
not be divided. But this is what would happen if the South secedes.
Q) What would you do if Sudan is divided, and you stood to lose all those
revenues?
A) Firstly, oil is not a matter of life and death. We lived before the
discovery the oil in our land, and we will be able to live even if we lose a
considerable portion of our oil revenues.
Secondly, oil has been discovered in northern Sudan. We hope that this will
offset the loss of the oil fields in the South
Thirdly, we have started introducing the policy of reducing imports,
increasing custom taxes and economizing government expenditure.
Q) What are these government actions?
A) When President al-Bashir appointed me as Minister of Finance, I conducted
a study regarding Sudan's exports and imports. I found out that we import
over 9 billion dollars worth of goods every year: about one billion dollars
for vehicles, around two billion dollars for wheat, 100 million dollars for
oil, and about the same amount for furniture, fruits, children toys and
other luxury imports..
According to my new policy, we must reduce luxury imports. Consequently, I
have already ordered to cease imports of second-hand cars, because in the
long run, a used car is a burden on its owner and the country's economy.
Furthermore, I have talked to the Sudanese about going back to the old
Sudanese traditions of eating, beside wheat, "dura" (sorghum) and "dokhon"
(millet), and making "kisra' (bread sheets from sorghum).
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